Jeff Probst Breaks Down The Worlds Apart Final Five And Next Season's Second Chance Twist

 

For the first time ever, viewers have the opportunity to cast a season of Survivor, by voting for 20 former players out of a pool of 32 men and women. It’s only the third time Survivor has pursued a full-on season of returning players, and it’s certainly the first time the show has handed the keys to the casting kingdom over to the fans. With so much power in the hands of deep-cut Survivor devotees and casual viewers alike, prospective players are hustling harder than ever to win over votes. In a very real way, Season 31 is already underway, even as Worlds Apart rages toward the finish line.

It’s hard to think of a more exciting and active time in recent Survivor history than right now, what with the Worlds Apart finale just around the corner, and with fandom actively involved in shaping the show’s next season. With all these spinning plates in play, I spoke with host Jeff Probst for his take on the current season’s final five, and his take on next season’s game-changing casting twist — a potential lineup that includes Carolyn Rivera and Mike Holloway, two of the competitors still on the quest for the Sole Survivor title.

Jeff, set the stage for us going into the finale. What are we looking at as we head into the last episode of Worlds Apart?

Well, Dan was just voted out in one of the most delicious blindsides you could ever hope for, with the confidence of having an extra vote and the certainty that he was in control of the vote. To then see him get it handed to him? It kind of represents this season very well. It’s been a season driven by personalities, in which the personalities are so big that they’ve somewhat obscured some really good gameplay. Last night was evidence of yet another masterfully handled blindside.

Now we have a final five of Carolyn, Will, Sierra, Rodney, and Mike — and you still have a mixture of White Collar, Blue Collar and No Collar, a real mixture of personalities. This finale is a good one. I think the audience is going to be completely satisfied with the amount of drama and action that’s going to happen.

Let’s talk about the final five, starting with Mike. He does not have many friends left out there. What’s your take on what he has to do to win?

There’s this momentum in Mike, with his back still up against the wall, everybody wanting to take him out… and he really has no option other than winning. This group will at its first chance get rid of him. What Mike’s trying to make happen is use that momentum and that leverage to find one ally, just somebody, to come over to his side, hoping he can convince them to ensure their bet by going with a winner. He needs somebody to help ensure his life in the game. That’s kind of a story that’s happening.

Next up, Mike’s fellow Second Chance contender, Carolyn, the lone White Collar in the game. Do you like her odds?

Carolyn has a very good shot at winning, if she gets to the end. It would certainly be helped by who she goes to the end with. If Mike or Rodney make it to the end, Carolyn’s job is tougher. If she can get to the end with Will and Sierra, I think her job is easier. She’s a legitimate contender, and she’s earned it. Carolyn has played a really quiet game, but she made a big move last night. I think Carolyn’s game has surprised a lot of people. When it started, she was labeled the older woman, the uptight White Collar, but what I’ve seen come out of Carolyn is all of her White Collar quality with a bit of a Blue Collar attitude. She’s really digging in and getting dirty. She’s not afraid to mix it up and betray somebody. She’s also not afraid to make an alliance with someone who may seem unlikely.

Carolyn really ratchets her game up in this finale in terms of, “All bets are off. Whatever I said before doesn’t matter. I have to get to the end.” If she does, she has a shot at winning.

I think Rodney has been overlooked this season as the goofball, the guy who says these wild and crazy things, but he’s proved he has some game. Can he legitimately win this?

Yeah, I agree. I think you said it well. I think Rodney’s been overlooked this season. He’s probably been overlooked by me a little bit. He’s so big in personality. His impressions are so funny, and his tantrums are epic. It’s hard to get past the guy who can imitate three people at once and also can legitimately complain about them not helping celebrate his birthday in a way he felt was appropriate. I think even I got more caught up in the Rodney that was complaining and growling all the time, as opposed to the guy who is actually worked a pretty decent alliance for a long time, and has moved a lot of people around, going back to Joaquin. He was playing very early.

I think Rodney can surprise a lot of people if he can get to the end with a speech that might make you go, “Oh my god, I actually forgot what a game you’ve played, because you’ve been your own worst enemy.” If anyone can turn a jury with their gift of gab, it would be Rodney.

He’s a hustler, Jeff.

He’s a hustler! He is! If Rodney makes it to the end, he would certainly have my consideration, because of how he got there.

How about Sierra? Do you see a path to victory for her, or has her game been too quiet? Is there anything she can do in these final days? 

I think Sierra has a shot, but only if she gets to the end with the right people. In her case I would say she needs to go with Will and Carolyn, and then her biggest battle would be with Carolyn. She’s an example of what happens if you don’t sooner or later make a move. People criticize me often for saying you have to make big moves in this game. They always couch it the same way: “Oh, you just want people to make big moves for your show.” To which I say, we’re in our 30th season. Survivor is doing fine. I’m just telling you what I see, and here’s the perfect example: If you do make it to the end, and that’s your only goal, then you’ve accomplished it. But if your goal is to win, then you have to have done something to have that quote-unquote “Survivor resumé” that allows you to say, “Here’s why I deserve it more than the other people.”

That’s the situation Sierra finds herself in. She has an opportunity with somebody like Mike, who doesn’t have anyone. If someone goes over to Mike and makes a big enough move, then you can make an argument: “I waited like a little cat, crouched in the corner, until I saw the mouse, and then I made my move and here it is. I turned the game upside down.” It’s just… she has a much bigger road, because she has to make it happen.

A big road and not a lot of time to walk it — and I think you could apply that to Will, except that there might not be any time to walk it. From my perspective, I do not see a scenario where Will can win. Do you?

Well, I think Will really hurt himself with the Shirin situation. I’m curious if he realizes that. In defense of everyone in that game, you do get depleted. I can speak to that. I’m just returning from a season and I’m mentally, completely exhausted. I feel like I lost IQ points out there. [Laughs] The situation Will finds himself in is one of the reasons I love Survivor. He got himself in a hole by making a really ugly comment about “playing the victim.” If he’s stuck in that hole? He deserves to be stuck in that hole — because Survivor is a game about society, and society decides the rules. I like that.

If Will can find a way out of this? Then that means he’ll show some amazing insight and grace and awareness, and people believe it. But you build your own world out there. You create your own dilemmas and trap doors — or you create a situation where you have so many things to brag about because you’ve played such a beautiful game. So I don’t go into this thinking, “Poor Will. He doesn’t have a shot.” I go into this thinking, “Will, you’re in a major hole — and if anyone put you there, it’s you.”

We’re talking about Worlds Apart, but in a very real way, Season 31 is already underway.

It really feels alive. I love that. I love that we had the courage to truly let the audience make the choice. I get a daily output of numbers and I’m looking at casts flipping and flopping on an hourly basis. It’s very active, and I’m surprised that there are people actually moving positions. Whatever they’re doing out there to sway people to vote for them, it’s working — in some cases, anyway.

It’s very exciting. There is definitely an electricity that I can feel, and I’m feeling it from the 32 nominees. When we put this list together, it was really, truly and honestly difficult. We started with 75 people. We went through and said, “Who are all the people you can make a case for?” And there are a lot. And then we started looking, “Okay, let’s try to spread it out over the seasons.” That starts eliminating people. Then you start saying, “Okay, who is the most colorful interview?” And you eliminate more people.

You look for all these ways to separate and pull people out, and you’re left with a list of maybe 40 — and from there you have to get it down even smaller because there’s a point where the number’s just too big and you can’t even comprehend it.

The whole time we’re doing it, I’m aware we’re crushing a bunch of people’s hearts. Every time we pulled someone out, I would think, “Oh, God, if they only knew. They were this close.” But we’re left with a list where everybody involved with the list was happy. We were comfortable turning this over to our fans, because any 20 that they choose, we’re happy with. We like. We put them here for a reason.

Some of these people, you’ll look at them and go, “Who is that again?” And others, you’ll go, “I’m so glad they’re on the list.” But for us, every one of these people are people we originally put on the show, and every one of them are people that we think might have an interesting second go at it.

What it resulted in is this incredible motivation. I have not seen this motivation matched by any other group, including the biggest super fans in the world. This motivation is based on experience. Now I’m looking at 32 people who have played this game once. They know what they’re in for. They know that they’re in for an ass-kicking — and they want it. They’ve been waiting for so long. Savage has been waiting since season seven. Kelly Wiglesworth has been waiting for 15 years. They’ve been pining for this, night after night, dreaming about it. “What did I do wrong? How did I get screwed over? How can I get this back?” That’s what I’m excited to see, to drop them on the island and say, “Hey, let’s see what you got.”

Season 31 is only your third full-fledged all-stars season. When you chose to cast newcomers for Worlds Apart, you famously said, “It’s just Season 30.” Why do you feel like next season is the right time to bring players back?

You hear a lot of people say this on shows they work on. Nobody can love a show more than we love our show. It’s impossible. We work day and night to get this right. We think through every twist. Is it the right twist? What are the possible ramifications? Once we decide we like it, we’ll work on the execution. How strong are we going to execute it? Is it going to be a soft execution? A discovery? An absolute? What are we going to do, when are we going to deliver it, and what words do I use to deliver it in a way that puts the right spin on it?

We look at every single moment wondering how it’s going to impact the game. Then, when we wondered through all of that, and lived in this imaginary world, then we just spit it out and never look back. That lack of fear, and it’s something I get into with the network often — we will never produce Survivor from fear, ever. If we’re doing it, we’re doing it. If we’re jumping out of a helicopter, yell “Geronimo!” while doing it. Just jump!

Going into Second Chances… I keep saying this over and over in interviews, and no one ever picks up on this story, really, but it is our audience that gives us the power to take chances. I don’t ever sit on the island and go, “Oh man, we’re dead. We’re dead!” I go, “They’ll tell us if they like it.” But I never feel like my girlfriend’s going to break up with me because I picked one bad restaurant, and that is powerful, man, in an era where people will drop a show, fast — like you’ve seen with American Idol in the last couple of years. They’re done. We have this luxury, and that’s what gives you the power to fail. Any great leader, any successful entrepreneur, any billionaire, ends up telling you the exact same thing: “My greatest lessons came from my mistakes, and the reason I was able to make mistakes is because I have the courage to try. Sometimes I was right, sometimes I was wrong.”

Going into this, I feel very good about Second Chances, because of the motivation. The motivation is key on Survivor. The times when people fail us, when we pick the wrong people to put on the show, it’s because we misread their motivations. If you come on Survivor and you’re motivated, that’s all you have to be. Doesn’t matter if you’re first out or last out. If you’re truly playing the game, you’ve fulfilled your obligation to us and the audience. That’s all they want to watch. They want to watch you try, dude. Yeah, you were first out, but you could come back next season and win. That’s how Survivor works.

I’m excited. We’ve never done anything like this. And think about this: We have 32 people who volunteered to show up at a live show knowing they might not get chosen. Talk about the ultimate blindside! This is the audience speaking. “The audience has spoken — and we don’t want you.”